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Generation I Glitch Discussion

Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different? - Page 1

Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: echinodermata
Date: 2009-01-25 19:55:06
Nearly everything in Red/Blue and Yellow are identical… so why are hex-equivalent glitches so different between the versions?

Re: Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: Bent`
Date: 2009-01-25 20:42:14

Nearly everything in Red/Blue and Yellow are identical… so why are hex-equivalent glitches so different between the versions?

Because the games aren?t exactly identical. It only takes one byte to cause a massive change in a computer program.

Re: Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: Torchickens
Date: 2009-01-31 08:17:27

Nearly everything in Red/Blue and Yellow are identical… so why are hex-equivalent glitches so different between the versions?


Also i suppose you could say that the actual order of the gaming code is arranged differently, yellow needs an extra byte for the surfing minigame and maybe parts of the title screen which is probably why pokemon yellow encounter codes differ by one location, likewise the game will have to search a different location for the picture, the stats, the name and most factors in those glitches.

Re: Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: echinodermata
Date: 2009-02-03 18:54:00
Yes, these are general answers, but I'm looking for a specific one.

That is, what junk data specifically is the game reading, that of all things just happens to be version specific?

Re: Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: glitchhunter09
Date: 2009-02-03 18:55:38
Also lets not forget Mr.Ego himself: Special Yellow Pikachu. he had to be put in to change some of the coding too you know. The thing that i find weird is that in Red and Blue when you battle Oak, He has whatever starter was leftover. In Yellow he always has a Blastoise. (except on occasion when he has Koffings, Magnemites, and Voltorbs in their 30's in his party instead.)

Re: Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: GARYM9
Date: 2009-02-03 20:39:44

Also lets not forget Mr.Ego himself: Special Yellow Pikachu. he had to be put in to change some of the coding too you know. The thing that i find weird is that in Red and Blue when you battle Oak, He has whatever starter was leftover. In Yellow he always has a Blastoise. (except on occasion when he has Koffings, Magnemites, and Voltorbs in their 30's in his party instead.)


Since there were no normal starters to begin with, its default is you chose a Bulbasaur and RIVAL chose a Charmander.

Re: Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: glitchhunter09
Date: 2009-02-03 20:42:38
What about the instances where Oak has the party that a Scientist NPC Trainer usually would have that I mentioned above. Is it Possible that it could belong to the Cheif even though Oak is using it. I want to do some Experiments with Oak's GS Code and Alter it to battle Cheif instead.

Re: Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: Bent`
Date: 2009-02-03 20:55:05

Yes, these are general answers, but I'm looking for a specific one.

That is, what junk data specifically is the game reading, that of all things just happens to be version specific?

That?s a very difficult question to answer. The biggest reason is that data doesn?t even have to be very different?if the games used exactly the same coding but one byte were changed, it is conceivable that that one modification could cause extreme glitches. The second reason is that there is no ?junk data? in the games that I know of?it?s all normal game code that is being read in the wrong place. For the same effect, try opening a .gif file in Notepad.


Since there were no normal starters to begin with, its default is you chose a Bulbasaur and RIVAL chose a Charmander.

Are you sure about that? Things like that would be impacted by flags in scripts, but most encounters with Oak are not scripted. Oak?s teams are really three completely different ones stored separately, which is why you need three different Gameshark codes to encounter each one (01E259D0 01015DD0, 01E259D0 01025DD0, and 01E259D0 01035DD0).


What about the instances where Oak has the party that a Scientist NPC Trainer usually would have that I mentioned above. Is it Possible that it could belong to the Cheif even though Oak is using it. I want to do some Experiments with Oak's GS Code and Alter it to battle Cheif instead.

Chief has no party. Chief has a name and a sprite (which is simply that of a scientist), but no Pok?mon associated with him.

Re: Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: GARYM9
Date: 2009-02-03 21:12:51

Since there were no normal starters to begin with, its default is you chose a Bulbasaur and RIVAL chose a Charmander.

Are you sure about that? Things like that would be impacted by flags in scripts, but most encounters with Oak are not scripted. Oak’s teams are really three completely different ones stored separately, which is why you need three different Gameshark codes to encounter each one (01E259D0 01015DD0, 01E259D0 01025DD0, and 01E259D0 01035DD0).


Never mind then, I was thinking one of his parties was like the Lv. 66-70 one in R/B/G.

Re: Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: glitchhunter09
Date: 2009-02-03 21:26:41
What do you suppose the other Parties were for? Oh and what would happen if I did try to make the cheif fight me using an altered version of Oak's code. I'd also imagine that the Scientist Sprite was put in there as a duplicate to prevent the wrong shit from being loaded. (It was a failed attempt in long run. Silly Game Freak.) it would seem redundant for there to be two identical Sprites meant for two different Trainer classes. I mean a scientist's sprite doesn't go well with the name Cheif, I'm sorry to say. Of course that's just me. Anyways this has gone waaaay off subject so maybe we should stop here before chaos insues.

Re: Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: Bent`
Date: 2009-02-03 21:35:12

Never mind then, I was thinking one of his parties was like the Lv. 66-70 one in R/B/G.

No, I mean that they are stored separately, not that they differ in any significant way. All three teams only differ by one Pok?mon, the starter.


Oh and what would happen if I did try to make the cheif fight me using an altered version of Oak's code.

Since no team for Chief is defined, the game would roll into the next trainer class and show a Scientist?s team. A Gameshark code demonstrates this: 01E359D0 01015DD0.


it would seem redundant for there to be two identical Sprites meant for two different Trainer classes.

How about two identical trainer classes, both named Juggler? That?s in the game too. ;)

Re: Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: glitchhunter09
Date: 2009-02-03 21:43:02
Lol. So basically you are saying that the Cheif is just a scientist's Beta name? I figured that taking a completely different pokemon game as an example: Ruby and Sapphire and using the Boarder Trainer data with the school boys sprite appearing instead due to being a place holder was basically what was going on with the Scientist's Sprite being placed in the Cheif's old hex slot to prevent crashing.

I'm sorry if what I just said made absolutely no sense. I couldn't figure out how to word what i was going to say.

Re: Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: Bent`
Date: 2009-02-03 22:02:21

Lol. So basically you are saying that the Cheif is just a scientist's Beta name?

Not at all. 01XX59D0 01YY5DD0 is the Red/Blue trainer battle code. XX represents the trainer class, YY represents the trainer in the class. (In true ?what were they thinking? fashion, Game Freak treats the battle as a Pok?mon fight if the YY value is zero. This works well enough for XX ≤ 0xBE, but causes major glitches when the value is 0xC9 to 0xF7, the trainer classes. Hence why encountering trainers causes weird things to happen when doing the Cinnabar coast trick?but I?m on a tangent here.)

Since there are no trainers in the Chief class, it rolls over into the next one, which happens to be Scientist.

C9 is the Youngster XX‐value. Increment the YY‐values enough, and you?ll start seeing Youngsters with Caterpies and Weedles, because when the game runs out of existing Youngsters it will roll over into the Bug Catcher trainer class (CA). This demonstrates the same principle.

Re: Why are equivalent trade pokemon so different?

Posted by: glitchhunter09
Date: 2009-02-04 14:16:03
I see. Getting back to Professor Oak, I never got a good answer as to why if you battle some trainers, such as the Lass closest to Lavender Town on route 8 for example, Oak has a Party of Pokemon a Scientist would normally have and their levels are in the 30s. Is that roll over data too or is it actually a completely different line up for Oak. Oh and as a side note: The Bulbapedia article for Reg and Green Beta is inaccurate. It says that Oak says "It can't Be!" I know for a fact though that the Swimmer that most people use for the fight says that upon being defeated. Likewise the When I fought Oak using the Lass mentioned Earlier, he said a her comment which made him sound like a wimp. It was "Don't be mean to my pokemon!" or something like that. It was kind of funny actually. Now that I think of it I should start a new Pokemon Red Savefile (I have it downloaded but I haven't started to really play it.) Anyways, I'm going to see just how many different line ups appear depending on Trainers battled.

Oh and the Pokemaniac just north of Lavender, Triggers the Final Battle party for Oak. So a Player could alternatively use him if they wanted to instead of the Swimmer in Cerulean Gym.

Oh I think all of these comments related to Oak should be moved to the Professor Oak topic just because it is way off subject. I'm glad I'm pretty much done here though at least.