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Generation III Glitch Discussion

Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches. - Page 23

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: Metarkrai
Date: 2014-06-30 03:35:49
werster : For Kraust's case, I think that the last Pokemon center he visited was Ever Grande's, and he corrupted the adress for spawning entrance (not map) location, which made him spawn into the sea (and also stuck).

Spawning in trees or water will always happen with the corruption of the spawning entrance, as its identifier will for example go from 0011 to 4011 or 0511 (for Odale Town), and the value is far too high to be affiliated with some element on the core of the map (a real buidling entrance, a PNJ, or near a wall), so we're teleported into the extremes of the map, and stuck there.

I also didn't read everything about the instant battle glitch, so I don't know what kind of moves trigger it (and what are the best Pokemon / Evs / Moves to use to obtain them quickly), as for swarms, only certain glitch moves can be obtained (like 4021, 0521, 40D5, 05D5 for Skitty).
Furthermore, the swarm has to be triggered, and I don't know how this trigger works (it seems to be a daily event, so one would need to check every day if a swarm outbreak spawned or not), but I don't think you would be able to pull one in a speedrun (as it's linked to daily events).
Obtaining a certain glitch move would be quicker with the usual Boxes corruption, because having a Swarm is long.
I don't even think you can get a Swarm before ending the game, but it may be possible as I don't really have data over their generation (contrary to the structure).

Your strategy seems good, as it is possible to activate or desactivate a bit with the corruption, so making Ever Grande flying location available is possible (I did it while mass corrupting).
The potential threat would be the freezing on weather zones, as we don't know for now where are the adresses that cause this freeze, and if a corruption for obtaining Ever Grande or the 8th Badge could also alter this adress (there is little chance for this, but it could happen).

Also, the event I should look for is the Wailord removal at Lilycove, as it is a major block for accessing to Badge 7.
Also, Badge 7 way not be useful, as the game doesn't check if every badge has been obtained, but only if important badges were obtained (6th and 8th badge I think), so the 7th badge may be skippable.

In return, I think that an issue could raise from this strategy, as Waterfall is needed in Victory Road (if I'm not wrong).
So we would also need a strategy to quicly obtain a Pokemon with Waterfall.
And, do Bad Eggs who know a HM can use them ?


EDIT :

So yup, only Badge 6 is needed (8th Badge isn't even needed).
But Waterfall is needed, so the 8th Badge is needed for something.

Bad Eggs apparently can't use HMs. I tested for Surf, and if you push A in front of the water, you hear a sound (the same pushing A during a text), but no textbox appear.

EDIT 2 :
Okay, I'm also an idiot, as I forgot that I previously said that 8th Badge was on the right word on a double word, so it can't be corrupted.
It may not be true on console, but I highly doubt it, sadly.
So yeah, there will need sereval Glitzer Popping sessions, as during the story, there are health refilling events (1 or 2 I would say).

Also, when obtaining Pomeg Berries (I don't know how much you have, 6-7 being enough), here is how I see things :
Glitzer Popping to obtain Bad Egg with useful Glitch Move, then beat Fortree Gym Leader, then teach Fly, deposit Bad Egg, Revive Swampert, do another Glitzer Popping to obtain Ever Grande Flying location.
Then, surf to Mossdeep, get Dive, beat the Gym Leader.
Teach Dive, and go to Sootopolis.
Then go to Lilycove (I think that on Wailmer's right side, you would still be considered in Lilycove), Fly to Lilycove, Buy Fluffy Tails (if you need them to flee during the Victory Road or at the League).
After that, you would need to stick with the story, so Mt Pyre, Magma Hideout, Aqua Hideout,..,get to Undersea Cave (it may also be faster to access it from Ever Grande, who knows)., get Waterfall, get 8th Badge, go to Ever Grande, do Victory Road, then League.

I'll search about event corruption, to see if some trainers or other things may be skipped, like one hideout, or something like that.
Also, Swampert would need to have a sufficient level (and suficient HP ev, but with 1-2 HP Up found on Routes 111 and/or 116 and other EV lowering Berries, it should be enough) to lose 2 HP with one Pomeg.
So you would mabe need to wait to make the first Glitzer (the earlier being the best, so before Fortree, after Fortree Gym, at Lilycove, or after Mt.Pyre).

If there aren't enough Pomeg or HP Up to repeat Glitzer Popping enough times, you can use your first two tries to duplicate Pomeg Berries and HP Up. This is also useful in the way that you can kill lots of birds with one stone, because the corruption have several patterns (I would say 32), so it is possible to place the Pomeg Berry or the HP Up (or another item like Rare Candy / Master Ball) on a certain place (Bag or PC) to get them corrupted with a pattern that would also corrupt something else, like Ever Grande Flying Location, Money, getting a good Bad Egg, or another in game event.
It is also maybe possible to corrupt 2 item quantites or more, and corrupt another interesting data, as there would be enough PC item and Bag item adresses to do so. It would then require lots of puny items to put the useful ones on precise places, but this would stil gain time, as you would reduce the number of needed Glitzer Popping (requires time for set up + success).


So now, I'll go check the story flag corruption.
Glitzer Popping will unfortunately not be as speedrun breaking as we thought earlier, but it would still save a good amount of time.


EDIT 3 :

Okay, so I've looked at the events, and here's what I found.
I still haven't searched for everything, as I would need saves during all the tiny Magma/Aqua events to see if the corruption combined qith some other flag can end everything.
I only looked at the direct effects of the flags on events.

Corruptible events :
Mt Chimney Magma Sbire (one that blocks the way towards Lavaridge)
1st Sbire of Meteo Center
1st Sbire of Mt Pyre

Archie in front of Sootopolis Gym (0x02026CD4)
Sootopolis Arena Door (0x02026C80)

So yeah, you've read it right, you can directly unlock Sootopolis Gym and go fight the Champion without having to bother about Teams Aqua/Magma.

But, and there's a big but, the two main issues are for Dive and Waterfall.
Dive is given by Steven when you beat Team Magma as Mossdeep. And that Team Magma is triggered by our win at the Gym, so Dive is easy to obtain.
The double Battle with Steven should be checked to see if it's skippable with the same Bad Egg.
Thus, we can go to Sootopolis, go to the Gym, wreck the leader, and obtain the 8th badge. (Archie isn't needed since its sprite appears at Sootopolis once you awakened Kyogre, but since you skipped Mt Pyre, Aqua Hideout, Magma Hideout, Underwater Cave, you're sure to not see him there)

The only thing left is getting Waterfall.
Waterfall is given by Wallace when Rayquaza after Groudon and Kyogre are tamed, so you have to clear underwater Cave, Magma Hideout, and Sky Pillar to obtain it.
And for underwater Cave, I don't know exactly what triggers it (what removes the Aqua guard from it), as getting Dive after preventing Team Magma from stealing fuel didn't unlock it, so maybe cleaning Aqua Hideout is also required. (I'm not sure of it, I need to test more)
But, getting the 7th Badge removed every Aqua guard in the Hideout, and as I mass cheated to test it, I'm a little lost (I also have all the badges, and all the flying locations, which may influence some little things).

There's another method to obtain Waterfall, and that would be obtaining it with a corrupted Pokemon.
The identifiant corresponding to Waterfall is 7F, which corresponds to Pinsir.
Pinsir is at 5% in one of the Nothern Zone of the Safari Zone, so it's maybe a gain of time to get the Pokeblock Case, make 2 Pokeblocks (for increased chances of capture), go to Safari Zone, catch one or two, and try to glitch him into a Pokemon that would know Waterfall, and the thing would be done.

So I have to know what are the requirements for unlocking Underwater Cave (Beating Team Magma at Mossdeep doesn't seem enough, Aqua Hideout is maybe needed), and if beating Mt Pyre + Aqua Hideout + Underwater Cave + Magma Hideout + Sky Pillar is longer than Making 2 Pokeblocks + Going to Safari Zone + Catching Pinsir (1 or 2) + Glitching it into a Waterfall Pokemon.

It is also possible to glitch Silcoon for Dive, but as there are few Team Magma grunts at Mossdeep, it isn't a gain of time.


EDIT 4 :
Beating Aqua Hideout + Team Magma at Mossdeep doesn't make the grunt go away.
So, there's another thing needed to activate his flag, and that may be clearing Mt Pyre and/or watching Team Aqua steal the submarine.
Also, the byte at 0x02026D12 can alter the last Aqua Hideout grunt, making you unable to "clear" Aqua Hideout (the Wailmer won't go away).

And there are enough Pomeg Berries to make Glitzer Popping for a run, so there's no need to corrupt their quantities.


EDIT 5 :
Yes !
I finally found a viable route !
I was blocked at the Undersea Cave because I used a cheat to have all HMs, and I needed to go to Steven's house to receive HM 08 to remove the grunt, so I thought of some inconceivable triggers where there was only a simple thing to do.
Then, things went smoothly, as I beat everyone, unsealed Kyogre, went to see Rayquaza, who cleared the issue, and Sootopolis Gym doors opened !

To sum up a little my attempts, here's the route that one can use with Glitzer Popping :
Make the way up to Route 119 / Route 123 for Pomeg Berries. (6 of them on each location).
Prepare in the PC some Pokemon that, when corrupted, would give Bad Eggs with a move corrupting the battle style for random encounter style, allowing fleeing.
Have a Swampert (the Pokemon with the upper level, and the most HP in the party) with enough HP EV and enough levels to work for GLitzer Popping.
Use Glitzer Popping to corrupt the PC Pokemon and obtain a desired Bad Egg.
Beat Fortree Gym.
Teach Fly to a Pokemon.
Do Glitzer Popping again to unlock Ever Grande City flying location (there may be a way to gain time and do it before corrupting PC Pokemon, and I'll search on this)(and this is a NO, as you have to reset and the reset needs a Glitzer set up).
Fly to Ever Grande City, then go at Mossdeep.
Beat Mossdeep Gym.
Start beating up Team Magma at Mossdeep, then revive your Pokemon for the double battle, as you have to select Pokemon to launch it, so I don't  really think you can do it with a fully KO team (I'll also search on this).
If you revived your team, KO it again, and Glitzer Popping.
Take Dive, and teach it.
Go to Undersea Cave, beat it.
Go to Sootopolis.
Go to Cave of Origin, then go to Sky Pillar (Flying to Ever Grande might be faster)
Wake Rayquaza up, leave him restaure peace.
Go peacefully to the 8th Gym, with Waterfall HM in your bag. Beat it.
Go to Ever Grande. Beat Victory Road. Beat League.

Thus, you would need to set up Glitzer 3 times in a run.
The best area for Glitzer Popping is Odale, so once Fly is obtained, you would need to Fly to Odale to make it, as you would gain time over your resets for Ever Grande Flying location.
HP Up that can be found in Routes 111 and 116 might be useful for this (don't know if Route 111 HP Up can be directly accessed though).
One would also need a strategy for the Double Battle with Steven with a weak Swampert.

Skipped areas :
Route 121
Lilycove City
Aqua Hideout
Magma Hideout
Mt Pyre


My wonders are :
Can we also glitch the battle with Steven ?
Can we do Glitzer Popping for Ever Grande FLying Location First ? As you don't have to relaunch it once you did it right.
But the answer is : It isn't useful, as I didn't think about the console factor : you can't launch savestates.
So even if you did Ever Grande Flying Location first, you would need to make a save point to reset for a good corruption pattern after that. And this save means setting Glitzer Popping up again, so yeah, this point seems done.
So there's no real wonder.


I don't know if the corrupted Pokemon will be enough to flee from every battle, or if Fluffy Tails will be needed (before Mossdeep, a turn towards Lilycove would be needed, but nothing really long).
Lilycove Shop is also useful for buying HP Ups, if a last one is needed.

I also worry about one bad thing that can happen with Glitzer Popping, which is the possible disappearance of the TM/HMs, but I'm looking about it. I think that the corruption of bytes in the TM/HM memory area cause this glitch, as the game will see an item with a quantity and no identifiant, and since the TM/HM bag uses instant arrangement, it makes the other TMs unreachable with the pointer (but they're still in the bag).
So for the ones interested in corrupting item quantities, I recommend you to store all your TMs into your PC, and to teach your HMs to lots of Pokemon (or keep a save / savestate by hand). If you use a cheat to fill up your TM/HM bag, I don't think that this bug would appear.

This wouldn't be bothersome on speedrun as the adress for Ever Grande Fly is below bag items.


Unlocking Flying towards Ever Grande City :
Adress : 0x02026050
You need to maintain up for 13 seconds to attain the adress.
Once the screen turns blue, you are just a dozen of bytes above, and you can stop.


I made some tries with Swampert to see what would be the required level for a 2 HP loss.
Mine had 3 HP IV, and it gained 2 HP one time at Lv 38 (it went from 125 HP to 127 HP with the second HP Up).
So, the level nearly matches the level of a Swampert around Fortree (it's a little higher, but only 3-4 Levels of farming would be required).
I'll try later with a 30/31 HP IV Swampert, as this kind of IV is clearly identifiable with a Lv 5 mudkip, and could decrease the level of the first 2 HP Loss. HP Ups would then be useful to trigger another 2 HP Loss, and there are 2 available on Routes 111 (requires Surf) and 116 (hidden zone of Rusturf Tunnel), so this is perfect for a 3 Glitzer Popping use. More HP UPs could be bought at Lilycove for the 3rd Glitzer if needed.

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: werster
Date: 2014-06-30 17:03:11
You only need to drop 1 HP, 2 isn't required. As long as you faint the Pokemon in question after you deposit all alive Pokemon including the last one you used in battle, it works as required, so HP isn't an issue.

The main "theory" that would be faster, is if you could get a good Egg with a glitch move that allowed you to skip battles, so you could use it for Mossdeep Gym and the Steven Double Battle (Mainly mossdeep Gym) - If you didn't do this, both of these fights would be extremely hard, mostly the Mossdeep one, since by the time you start Glitzer popping, you really only have a Marshtomp at 34 if done correctly. You can obviously Rare Candy to 37 or so, and it's winnable (I already routed this fight), but pretty long.

In regards to Waterfall… 127 EVs is a really bad number to work with, since you can't just get there through Vitamins. How about a more classical Approach, Goldeen can be caught up to Level 30 (via Surfing, pretty Rare, but Good Rod isn't too bad) and learns Waterfall naturally at Level 38. That might be a bit of a stretch with regular Rare Candies, but I'm pretty sure you can corrupt Rare Candy values making that task pretty easy? If you still went the Safari Zone route, you can caught level 35 Goldeens in there, along with Level 40 Seakings (who learns it at 41) with the Super Rod, meaning you wouldn't have to rely on that corruption.

Edit: In regards to instant victory glitch, there are several glitch moves that do this in a number of different ways. Some turn it into a Birch battle that you can Fluffy Tail from, some a Wild Battle you can just run from, and turns some move that turns it into a Palace/Arena hybrid. But the best one simply just ends the battle as soon as you cancel out of the attack move. I don't know what ID it is since idk how to look at that garbage (and my save editor won't show it =() but here's a savestate that has a Bad Egg with the move:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/23821687/EmeraldIVGBadEgg.sgm
Emulator used: VBA-RR v24 snv461

As far as I can tell, that's the golden move. If you could get that onto a regular Pokemon somehow for the double battles…mmm

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: Metarkrai
Date: 2014-07-01 04:59:29
Oh ! Thanks for the advice, I didn't thought at all that the normal glitchy killing with Pomeg would be enough, that simplifies things.
As I am on emulator, I directly edited my Pokemon HP so I could at will be with a full KO team or not.

I also thought that there wouldn't be any Pokemon that would normally learn Waterfall (I thought that only Salamence + Rayquaza would learn Fly, and that's all).
I looked a bit at the encounter tables, and yeah, the fastest way is Super Rod on Safari Zone, as there is :
40% Goldeen 25-30
40% Goldeen 30-35
15% Seaking 30-35
4% Seaking 35-40
1% Seaking 25-30

Chances of capture :
Goldeen : 70.66% / 79.61% (with Pokeblocks)
Seaking : 36.17% / 58.62% (with Pokeblocks)

With this, you can easily have a high level Goldeen / Seaking, and Rare Candy / train it.
I don't exactly know how much Rare Candies you can get during such a run (and not use on Marshtomp / Swampert before Fortree), but 4-5 would be great, as it would be directly posible to Level Goldeen up to Lv 38.

Glizter is interesting, but time consuming, as with Rare Candies in your Bag and PC, you would have 2/32 chances to have a corruption pattern that would corrupt the Rare Candies quantity.
I don't really know how long it takes, but 1 Battle + going to Pkmn Center do Deposit + another Battle + 17 seconds of corruption + faint + check bag and PC, that would be around a minute (roughly).
So you may need 15 minutes to obtain the corruption you want, which is time consuming.

For Rare Candies, there are 2 of them in Route 120, 1 in Route 123, 1 in Mt Pyre, 1 in Route 132, 1 in Route 119, 1 in Route 111.
The fastest to obtain seem to be : Route 120 (2 of them), Route 111, Route 123, Route 119 (need Acro Bike), Mt Pyre.

For Route 111, this one could be taken during the run, as there are no trainers to face.
Then, while going to see Steven for Devon Scope, the first one on Route 120 can also be taken.
Once Fly is acquired, the Route 119 one can also be taken (or it can be taken while going at Fortree if the Acro Bike was already taken).
I'm hesitating a bit about the fastest route from there, between Mossdeep - Lilycove by Surf, or Fortree - Route 120 South, but I think Fortree - Route 120 South is faster.
Thus, you could go from Fortree (once badge acquired) to Route 120 south to get the Rare Candy (2nd one, or 3rd one if Acro Bike was already taken). There are 2 choices here :
Route 123 (Rare Candy) - Lilycove (Pokeblock Case + Shop) - Fly to Odale + Glitzer + Fly Location Ever Grande + Fly Ever Grande + Mossdeep (Super Rod + Gym + Double) - Change for Acro Bike + Take Route 119 Rare Candy (if not already) - Fly to Lilycove - Safari Zone (a break is needed to take Super Rod)
or, you directly go to Lilycove, make your way to obtain Pokeblock Case + Super Rod, and at the end, when going for Safari Zone, you go to Route 123, take the Rare Candy, and go to Mt Pyre to take a 5th Rare Candy, then Fly to Lilycove and go back at Safari Zone or go directly back to Safari Zone (I don't know which one is faster : climbing down Mt Pyre or Flying to Lilycove and taking Route 121 again).

Thus, you could go fishing for Goldeen/Seaking with 4-5 Rare Candies, and you would need 3 Glitzer for the run (Obtain Bad Egg - Ever Grande Fly Location - ReTake Bad Egg after Steven Double Battle + Open Sootopolis Gym Doors ) instead of 4.
Ever Grande FLying Location and Sootopolis Gym Doors are the Glitzer that would require the longest time.




EDIT :

I thought about it again, and I found a way to shorten this, and corrupt Rare Candies, so the one at the North of Route 120 can be picked if you need one (really quick to obtain)(need Cut).

I tried to obtain Sootopolis Gym Door and Ever Grande Fly Location corruption, to look at the rest of the corrupted data.
Ever Grande Fly Location :
4th Bag item quantity corrupted (can't tell about quantity because of quantity encryption)
4th PC item quantity corrupted (?85 if there was originally 1)

Sootopolis Gym Door :
2nd Bag item quantity corrupted (can't tell about quantity because of quantity encryption)
2nd PC item quantity corrupted (?81 if there was originally 1)

Thus, you can corrupt Rare Candies quantity along with one of these two events, et voilà.
You can also corrupt Repel or other little things if you think you'd lack of something during the game (as I don't think you're winning money with glitched battles).


But now, I'm hesitating about catching Goldeen in Safari Zone, as :
1st case :
You take Good Rod in Route 118, and you fish on Petalburg for a 20% Lv 10-30 Goldeen. Make it so it's stored on the PC.
Before fighting Team Magma, you take it, and level up.
Everstone would be a good pickup to fasten the levelling (chance, there's an easy one in Granite Cave).
After that you can go to Sootopolis, and make the final Glitzer.

2nd case :
You take Super Rod at Mossdeep.
Once Team Magma is done, you surf to Lilycove, take Pokeblock Case, go to Safari, Catch a :
40% Goldeen 25-30
40% Goldeen 30-35
15% Seaking 30-35
4% Seaking 35-40
1% Seaking 25-30
You give them an Everstone, and you fill them up with Rare Candies.

Then, you fly to Lilycove / Mossdeep, go to Sootopolis, and make the final Glitzer.


I'm hesitating about the time needed to level up a Lv 20 Goldeen to Lv 30, and the time to go to Lilycove, and to Safari Zone, but I think that 10 Rare Candy levels are faster.


Also, I don't know if there are other corruption patterns that would corrupt PC and Bag item quantities the same way (with the same glitched quantitied for PC items), but this could be a good indicator in order to know if the Sootopolis Gym Door corruption worked or not.


I've also looked for the Pokemon corruption, to see if there would be some Pokemon that would tend to corrupt into useful Bad Eggs.
In the savestate werster gave, the Bad Egg is a corrupted Tentacool. And the glitch move replaces Bubblebeam.
So i've caught a dozen of Tentacool, and at the second try, I got a convenient Egg.
But since you're on console, this would be the longest threat for the run, as you'd need to catch 6-7 Pokemon maybe, of a certain species (or not, mass experiments would be needed to see if Moves of pokemon identifiants have any kind of influence), to obtain some Bad Eggs, and test some of them in one reset. You can only test a maximum of 4 Bad Eggs in a single reset, as you can't change them in the PC.
To do so, you have to do a 2 Pkmn Glitzer (2 Pkmn remaining), withdraw the 4 Bad Eggs, and once one is tested, swap it with another Bad Egg, as the Pokemon shown in battle is the one at the place where the last alive Pokemon seen in battle was.
The game may freeze with a Bad Egg, so you won't be able to test 4 Bad Eggs everytime.

I am also testing with another Pokemon learning Bubblebeam : Marill, as it's easier to find one with the said move while surfing.

But I don't know what causes the move to be replaced by such a glitch move, and this may come from other things, so I'm just trying to see if the moves have some influence over it.

And this kind of glitch is pretty cool, since you also instantly flee from every battle, trainer or wild, so you'll only need repel in order to not be annoyed when surfing across the seas.


Thus, here's the actual route strategy :
During the run, get Pokeballs and catch 6 Lv 21-27 Marill on Routes 102 or 117. (4th slot Bubblebeam seems to generate Insant Win Bad Eggs quickly).
Get Everstone in Granite Cave.
Get Good Rod at Route 118.

a) Get Pomeg Berries at Route 123 and make Glitzer n°1 at Mauville to get a desired Bad Egg. Then climb up to Fortree.
b) Climb up to Fortree, then Get Pomeg Berries, and make Glitzer n°1 at Fortree (faster Glitzer, but Rival + Meteo Center fights)

( a) seems faster since only few Glitzer (5-6 I would say) are needed to obtain an Instant Win Bad Egg, and the time difference between going to Route 117 grass grom Mauville with Bike and going to Route 119 grass from Fortree isn't high).

Get a Rare Candy on Route 120.
Beat Fortree Gym.
Fly to Petalburg to fish for a 20% Goldeen (pray for a >Lv 20 one). Be careful of not putting it into Box 1/2.
Fly to Odale. Put Rare Candy in PC Slot 4. (Bag Slot 4 is faster, but I have things about item quantity corruption to look at).
Put Repel in Bag Slot 4. (So you'll have enough for the rest of the run).
Do another Glitzer until Ever Grande Fly Location is unlocked. Rare Candy quantity should be corrupted.
Fly to Ever Grande. Surf towards Mossdeep.
Beat Gym.

a) Start beating Magma Team, and stop before the double fight.
Revive Marshtomp/Swampert.
Take Goldeen into team, give him Everstone.
Rare Candy Level up time for Swampert and Goldeen.
Finish Magma Team.

b) Revive Marshtomp/Swampert.
Take Goldeen into team, give him Everstone.
Rare Candy Level up time for Swampert and Goldeen.
Beat Magma Team.

(5 Grunts are in the way, and Swampert may need more levels to beat them + the double battle)
(instead, flying towards Pokemon Center / running/biking to it isn't that slow )

Pick Dive HM. Teach it.
Surf towards Sootopolis.
Fly to Odale.
Do another Glitzer for Sootopolis Door Corruption.
Get Bad Egg back to work.
Beat Sootopolis Gym.

Beat Victory Road.
Beat Pokemon League.


If you want to corrupt Bag and PC item quanty, you need to holp Up (just after closing Pokemon Summary) for at least 17 seconds. (in 17 seconds you're into PC items quantity corruption), so time 18.5-20 seconds to be good.
For Sootopolis Gym Door, you'll need to hold Up for 13 seconds, so time 14.5-16 seconds to be good.


EDIT 2 :
So yeah, using a Pokemon with Bubblebeam in last slot gives in few tries a Bad Egg that induces instant battles.
I saw two kinds of instant battles :
-ones where once you push B, the screen fades and the battle is ended
-ones where if you choose Run, the game will say that you forfeited the match, and the battle is ended

The second effet isn't what you seek for speedruns, as it seems that if the Bad Egg is too slow (slower than the opponent I think), you'll only be able to forfeit on the 2nd turn. But if you're hurt during the first turn, the game will see that you have no Poke, and you'll black out.

In my tests with 15-20 Marill, the ones who made the best results where the ones who already had Bubblebeam as their last move (Lv 21-27), whereas the others where a bit slower to corrupt as Instant Win Bad Eggs, and they were also more frequently turned into Bad Eggs that would make the forfeiting message appear.

Furthermore, Marill are extremely easy to find and catch : you can go to Route 102 or 117 (not Petalburg, as the encounter rate is too low) to find them. Depending on the side you take once Surf is acquired, you'll go near one of these Routes.
I think that 6 Lv 21-27 Marill should be good, as you can test 4 eggs at each reset, and 6 Marill should give 3-4 Bad Eggs in general.

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: Kraust
Date: 2014-07-01 13:35:28
I think your over complicating the problem with getting Rare Candies when you can just get Rare Candies by random corruption and seeing what slots get frequently corrupted and switching your Rare Candy to that slot. One time running it successfully should be more than enough.

This does require a lot of items in your item bag for a higher chance of some bytes corrupting, and a chance at your entire berry and TM bags from emptying however.

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: VaeporSage
Date: 2014-07-01 13:45:40

I think your over complicating the problem with getting Rare Candies when you can just get Rare Candies by random corruption and seeing what slots get frequently corrupted and switching your Rare Candy to that slot. One time running it successfully should be more than enough.

This does require a lot of items in your item bag for a higher chance of some bytes corrupting, and a chance at your entire berry and TM bags from emptying however.


All TMs and berries 'lost' to corruption seem to re-appear whenever a new item is put in that slot. In fact, I think that even taking a TM/berry from the PC would undo the effect for you.

I have tried this, but unfortunately I haven´t managed to turn my Vaporeon into a Mew yet. All I get are Bad Eggs, no normal ones. But when I took one of the bad ones into my party and started a fight against a random wild Pokémon the Latias I had already caught once before showed up. When I checked its IVs it turned out that it´s exactly the same one. It seems like my try to get a Mew has reactivated this event.


I don't think this corruption of the roaming Pokémon has been documented yet.

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: werster
Date: 2014-07-01 13:49:25
Just a little note about the ideal Instant Victory Glitch, I also managed to get it off the Masrhtomp right as you enter Fortree. This savestate is pretty much a "what you would have" up to that point in the speedrun normally as well, with Ice Beam gotten from Abandoned Ship. It's moves were Strength/Ice Beam/Mud Shot/Surf
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/23821687/EmeraldMarshIVG.sgm

In regards to the Marill's were they seperately caught, or duplicated? My biggest worry doing this run real time was always that it was going to be majorly dependant on the substructure order and that the Personality Value was going to be too random to work, but if several worke and they were all caught seperately, so you can get that move independant of the PID, that's wonderful! I'll look into it more over the coming days I'm sure.

Quick little thing about the theory route, if you're using a Bad Egg you also need to revive before Tate & Liza, since that's also a double battle, so you'd probably fight the Mossdeep grunts normally too, as those double battles are only seperated by I think 7 other Pokemon.

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: Metarkrai
Date: 2014-07-01 15:29:02
Kraust :
Yup, at first, I thought of overcomplicated stuff, before thinking about corrupting quantites.
But, there doesn't seem to be some kind of more frequent pattern, well, for the attempts I've made so far.
I would hypothetically say that there are 32 different corruption patterns, and that they only depend on the movement of adresses, which is completely random, so every pattern should appear randomly.
To get a specific corruption pattern, like Ever Grande or Sootopolis Gym Door, it took me around 10-20 tries with other things (not really relevant, as I didn't do more than 5-6 successful corruptions).

I also don't know if two corruption patterns can affect the same bits of the same byte, so if some of you are trying to obtain Ever Grande Flying Location or Sootopolis City Gym, check if the quantities of respectively the 4th and the 2nd item of your bag is corrupted.


VaeporSage :
Thanks for the tip, that's really useful. I thought that my TMs would be lost forever (or before the code activation).

I know where roaming Pokemon data is stored, so I can look a bit at it, to see what was corrupted and brought the roamer back to life.
If I remember well, there is a bit that manages the roamer, and that is set when it's killed. But only corrupting its HP may be enough, as roamer's data is limited to status, remaining HP, location, PID, IVs, Poke, LV, there's no real Pokemon structure stored somewhere, so it may even be possible to alter the roamer a little bit (if the species was corrupted, I think the new roamer would crash any encounter, as it was the case for swarms when I tested it).


werster :
Thanks for the savestate, and for the advice.
As for Mossdeep, I always went to Navel Rock to catch Ho-Oh and Lugia and beat Tate & Liza, I didn't think of it as a battle where you need at least 2 alive Pokemon.
I would say that only 5 grunts separate the two double battles, as two of them seem skippable, but that may be 6 or 7, as I'm using a walk through walls cheat to directly go to the stairs.

For the Marills, and 4-5 Tentacool, I didn't clone them, to see what would happen in normal conditions, and I was able to corrupt all the Pokemon knowing Bubblebeam in 4th position. Once they worked, I released them to see if the others could be corrupted for Instant Win Bad Eggs.
But I released some of them too soon, as when I found the "fainted" Instant Win, I didn't know that it's based on the Bad Egg speed (I was trying on the first youngster on Route 102), so I considered them as corruptible Pokemon.
For my last attempt, I counted, and it took me 6 resets to correctly corrupt one Marill out of the 6 I had caught.
It seems that the moves count, as when I corrupt my Marill, I get a limited amount of glitched moves, even though they are different Marill.
I also looked at some Bad Eggs coming from my Boxes of Shinies, but the glitched moves are completely different and I'm not getting what I want.
Also, it seems that Pokemon who don't have 4 moves are harder to corrupt. That may only be an impression, but that's the feeling it gave me.

For Marills, my longest attemps before obtaining a successful Instant Battle Bad Egg was 7 resets, on a little bit more than 18 Marills (I have more than 6 Marills to be sure of having 4 Bad Eggs, and every successful Marill is released, and when I'm low on Marills, I go catch other ones). But since Marill has a catch rate of 190, it's not that big of a deal to catch one.

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: werster
Date: 2014-07-01 15:56:42
In regards to the roamer: I actually just had a Latias show up in the water before I even triggered her the first time. Nice.

In regards to the TMs/Berries disappearing, I can't seem to get them back. I just tried to do a second Pomeg, so I got another one from the Berry Master and it's still blank. I'm not sure how to restore these, am I missing something obvious?

Bubblebeam: That's great, so it's probably just based off the move as suspected. I wonder if there's an easier one than Bubblebeam, since I think Ice Beam was the one that got it to work on that Marshtomp, if a move like Rock Smash or something similar worked would simply the catching process (though im 99% sure Rock Smash does not work)

One more thing, why not set the Sootopolis Gym and Ever Grande flags at the same time (along with getting the IVG move)? Seems possible to scroll up past 6, check bag and see slot 4 is corrupted, go back to Pokemon and scroll up  past 6 again and then see slot 2 is corrupted as well, and simultaneously getting the desired Bad Egg too?

Edit: <_> Just double checked, you don't need Waterfall for Victory Road, it just makes it faster. Any reason you can't just set the Ever Grande flag, get bad egg with Instant Victory and storm through to Elite Four?

Edit 2: I must be understanding the flags wrong, I was under the impression that if you saw the 4th item value corrupt, that the Ever Grande Fly Location would be set, but I just corrupted slot 4 in my bag, and I still can't fly to Ever Grande. (In fact it actually gave me the tree pattern back at Fortree upon reload) Does that mean you just have to keep doing it till it works?

Edit 3: Hmm, this may be because I'm getting the wrong amount, I just did it again and the amount in the Box was x?81 rather than x?85 as stated above. I just assumed it could only go to one value.

Edit 4: Nevermind, just got x?85 in slot 4 and can not Fly to Ever Grande. =(

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: Kraust
Date: 2014-07-01 17:18:46
The tree pattern means you corrupted the map entrance, That's what we found out after I got the stuck in water tiles thing a page back.
I don't think the corruptions are fixed like you're saying, the problem is that they're highly irregular and there could be a dozen different factors to consider.

The only ways to know for sure that you're setting that flag would be to check the fly locations after battle or to actually look at the memory viewer.
Is there a Ram Dump that actually lists all of these addresses? I was trying to figure this out because I honestly don't know how to otherwise.


I think I might start an Emerald game and get to Fortree. I remember it takes forever however.

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: Metarkrai
Date: 2014-07-02 01:28:37
werster :
Once you're in battle, the position of the adresses is fixed, so you can scrolll up, push B, and scroll up again, the second scroll will only follow the traces of the second, so nothing would happen.

And yeah, if Waterfall isn't needed for Victory Road, you just need the 6th Badge, and you'll be able to enter the League.

Also, your tests helped, as you saw that there may be a corruption for 4th PC item quantity, even if Ever Grande Fly Location isn't enlabled.
I indicated the quantity to see in the PC as ?85 as the two possible byte corruption don't give off the same quantities ine decimal as well.
But what would help most would be trying to obtain Ever Grande Fly location and see if the 4th PC and Bag item quantity is always corrupted when Ever Grande is. The 3 times I looked for it, I got this result.
To check if you did the Ever Grande corruption, you have to check your fly map.

When I got Ever Grande Fly Location corruption, it also corrupted the Map Entrance, which gave me little issues to check what exactly was corrupted.
But I'll try this some more times today.


Kraust :
Well, as what I saw, the corruptions don't seem that irregular.
There may be different patterns appearing upon reset (I'll check that, as for now I use savestates), but when I'm doing Pokemon corruption, there are frequent patterns of Bad Eggs that are corrupted the same way as before that appear, which is a clear mark of a certain pattern that repeats itself.
Also, while looking at flag bytes, I saw that the corruption depends (and may only depend on this) on the position of the adresses (the ones that can move can have 32 different positions), so that's why my thought was that there was 32 corruption patterns.

For Memory Viewer adresses, I have a little file that I made myself who gives some adresses, and starting from this point, I navigate to the adresses I need, so for flags for example, I only have some adresses detailling their location, and once there, I pinpoint the flag I want to study myself.
Also, you the Anti-DMA is really useful to compare the values of a cerain adress between two savestates without it being a mess, as the movement of some adresses forces you to take marks to see where the adress you were watching went, and that can be a bit annoying.
I also use AR codes to have the location of other flags, like Flying location, Badge location, records location,…
And for my tests on the effects of flag corruptions, I generally overcheat to move to the desired location / event without any issue (with the walk through walls code, teleport codes, or fly everywhere code).

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: Stackout
Date: 2014-07-02 01:51:54

And yeah, if Waterfall isn't needed for Victory Road, you just need the 6th Badge, and you'll be able to enter the League.


Aren't there NPCs in front of the league entrance that check for 8 badges?

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: werster
Date: 2014-07-02 11:09:57

werster :
Once you're in battle, the position of the adresses is fixed, so you can scrolll up, push B, and scroll up again, the second scroll will only follow the traces of the second, so nothing would happen.


Yeah, figured that out myself after a bit of testing afterwards, was just being hopeful. Luckily this doesn't matter now, should only have to do it once.


Also, your tests helped, as you saw that there may be a corruption for 4th PC item quantity, even if Ever Grande Fly Location isn't enlabled.
I indicated the quantity to see in the PC as ?85 as the two possible byte corruption don't give off the same quantities ine decimal as well.
But what would help most would be trying to obtain Ever Grande Fly location and see if the 4th PC and Bag item quantity is always corrupted when Ever Grande is. The 3 times I looked for it, I got this result.
To check if you did the Ever Grande corruption, you have to check your fly map.


Alright I guess I'll just keep trying then. Seems like the odds are really wide to get this to work then though, as though in a run it could take several
hundred times. For reference, here's a savestate that has the exact corruption mentioned, except not Ever Grande, in case there's some other requirement: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/23821687/Emeraldwhy.sgm


Aren't there NPCs in front of the league entrance that check for 8 badges?


Those people are there, but they only check for Badge 6, assuming you have to get all the other ones (which is the laziest crap)

Edit: Just got the fly to Ever Grande. Slot 4 is not corrupted. It was in fact slot 10 that got corrupted when I was allowed to Fly there (however, it was my 5th attempted, and corrupted slots 1, 6, and 12 prior to that, but I found that irrelevant)

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: Kraust
Date: 2014-07-02 11:33:29
So I just made it to Fortree on a new save and started up this glitch again.

Cool thing I noticed was that if the pokrmom you switch into to activate the pomeg glitch only has 1HP you white out after the battle. I could probably make a video of this. It was weird.

And second thing I noticed was that I was running into wild pokemon on the route west of Fortree and the game froze (assuming right before a battle). This is something I haven't seen before.

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: Metarkrai
Date: 2014-07-02 11:50:07
werster :
Were you able to obtain Ever Grande Fly Location on the last savestate you've given ?
As I've tried, and it seems that on the large patterns, some "interferences" can happen, and some corrupted bytes might not be corrupted sometimes (depending on the value of other bytes).
And that's the casefor Ever Grande Flying Location.
There's a little byte that seems to alter the corruption pattern, and it avoids the Fly Location bytes when if should be their turn.
And there, the corruption you did for Swampert also counted, as you corrupted bytes far beyond Pokemon Boxes.

Thus, is you have a save that would be like a normal run, at Fortree, but wihtout the first Glitzer, I could try to see if Ever Grande Flying location can be corrupted, or see what bytes seem to be a threat, and how they could be managed, as I and some other people were able to corrupt this adress, with games completed or not.

This is a little strange though, as lots of other adresses are easily corruptible, but the structure of the near values are annoying us.


Kraust :
If you had tried some corruptions, I think the game froze because you made a fight with a Pokemon with an identifier of 40xx or 05xx.
It may have been a roamer, or a swarm, but since you're on a new file, it may be a roamer (if the "died" bit isn't activated, and if there is an identifier for a roamer, I think the game may activate it)(and it's easy to check if a roamer is in the place).

But see if you can obtain Ever Grande Fly location with corruption.
You can look at your fly map, or near 0x02026D24.
The byte has a value which is approximately 07DF8F87, so once you see it, you can follow it (since it only has 32 possible locations), and see how it can be corrupted. Also, the corruption will be (nearly) the same for a same position of the values, so if this value has the same place as during another attempt, you're nearly sure that it won't be corrupted.
I'm using "nearly" because if you're mass corrupting on a single savestate (without resetting), you may obtain some slight corruption changes on certain values, so, who knows.

Re: Gen III: Access Pokémon beyond the sixth slot sub-glitches.

Posted by: Kraust
Date: 2014-07-02 12:06:44
Well I was manually checking to see if I could fly to Ever Grande, and I didn't see it pop up.

I'm starting to think that the patterns are seeded when you first activate the pomeg glitch (specifically when you switch to the alive Pokemon before you deposit it). There seem to be way too many oddities on how If I save my game for example (and reset) after I activate the glitch I have to do it again to send out the Decamark.

So, I'm probably going to throw my Pomegs into my PC, use beyond the sixth slot a few times and then save + reset before setting up the Pomeg glitch again and seeing if I'm getting different results.

(Although I was able to get every stat on my Trainer Card to corrupt this time through, it was harder to get map entry corrupted and name corrupted which is something I could do frequently on my other save file).

tldr (Because I tend to be bad at explaining)

I want to:

activate the Pomeg Glitch
access beyond the sixth slot a few times to corrupt as much data as possible
save my game + reset
activate the Pomeg Glitch again (Because it's not persistent)
access beyond the sixth slot a few more times and see if I can finally get the Ever Grande Fly flag to flip.